Catherine & India Oxenberg On Moving On From NXIVM

On this episode of Pretty Messed Up, AJ McLean, Cheryl Burke, and Rene Elizondo discuss the finale of Dancing With the Stars and whether or not Bachelorettes have an advantage since Kaitlyn Bristowe is the third one to win. (But “we’ve had Bachelors on before and none of them can dance,” Cheryl says. “Two left feet, every single one of them!”) Then they welcome Catherine and India Oxenberg to the show to talk about their seven harrowing years in the NXIVM cult and what it took to get out and de-program from the indoctrination. How did Catherine first realize NXIVM wasn’t on the level? How did she get India out? Does India feel a sense of closure after the sentencing of the founder, Keith Raniere? And what’s next for the two of them?

Catherine says a respected friend told them about the self-help-styled program, telling them it would transform their lives. The first class they attended was filled with familiar faces, successful entrepreneurs, and celebrities, “giving that room instant credibility,” Catherine says. Everything seemed fine at first, but Catherine started to feel uncomfortable at the amount of aggressive recruiting to become a “coach” and make NXIVM the center of your life. “That was a red flag for me,” she says. But it was hard to see it for what it was, because of preconceived notions that smart people don’t fall for cults. This organization was full of intelligent people – “They had an entire Harvard contingency,” India says. It was more predatory, really, Catherine says: “They don’t prey on weakness. They’re looking for people they can use.” 

AJ asks if they have any closure at all with the indictment and sentencing of Keith and many others; India says yes. She read her victim impact statement at Keith’s sentencing, although she knew it would have no effect on him: “He’s a true sociopath, he has no empathy.” But she looked him in the eye several times as she spoke, and felt very calm that she had gotten it out of her system. “I do feel like justice was served – 120 years is a statement,” she says. It’s not over yet; “over 50 people sent letters of support” to Keith the day India testified, and there are still women loyal to him even after the sentencing. But at least India isn’t one of them: “I’m really grateful to have my life back,” she says. Hear the entire candid conversation on this episode of Pretty Messed Up.

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